官网:http://www.dissidenz-intl.com/2010/01/caterpillar-by-koji-wakamatsu/
【英文来自官网 个人翻译 欢迎拍砖】
【SYNOPSIS/剧情】
During the Second Sino-Japanese War, in 1940, Lieutenant Kurokawa returns home as a honoured and decorated soldier… but deprived of his arms and legs lost in the battle in mainland China. All hopes, from the villagemen and women to close family members, turn to Shigeko, the Lieutenant’s wife: she must honour the Emperor and the country in setting an example for all by fulfilling her duty and taking care of the ‘god soldier’…
1940 中日战争期间,黑川中尉在战争中光荣负伤而退役...然而 他在战争中失去了自己的四肢。所有人都把压力放在黑川的妻子Shigeko身上,不论是同村或近亲:她必须作为一个表率 完成群众的期待并照顾这个"神圣而光荣的士兵" 以显示自己对天皇及国家的尊重。
【DIRECTOR’S STATEMENT/导演说】
In war human beings are violated, chopped up and burnt by other human beings.
Humans violating other humans.
Humans chopping up other humans.
Humans burning other humans.
战争中 所有人都被亵渎 撕裂 互相伤害
Is there such a thing as a just war? Before the arrival of billowing mushroom clouds, falling incendiary shells or large-scale massacres, there were brightly lit houses filled with men, women, the aged and children— human beings. It was there that they ate and slept, ate and slept; living their routine lives.
所谓正义之战是否真的存在?在原子弹落地 炸弹爆炸或大屠杀进行之前 人-- 男人 女人 老人和孩子在明亮的屋子里生活。那是他们日常生活起居的地方。
What is the meaning of war? What is the meaning of people killing people for the sake of their country? Where in the world can we find a just war?
战争意义何在?
为了国家而杀人意义何在?
正义之战在哪?
Don’t forget the stench of blood that covered the earth!
Don’t forget the smell of burnt flesh!
We must not forget… for this is what war is.
不要忘了铺天盖地的血腥味
不要忘了尸体被焚烧的味道
我们不应该遗忘 因这就是战争的实质
Over 140,000 people died in the Hiroshima Atomic bomb attack.
Over 70,000 people died in the Nagasaki Atomic bomb attack.
984 class B and C war criminals were sentenced to death.
Over 100,000 died in the Bombing of Tokyo.
Over 20 million died in the Asian continent.
Over 60 million died in World War II.
超过14万人 因广岛原子弹丧生
超过7万人 因长崎原子弹丧生
984名2级3级战犯 被判死刑
超过10万人 在美军对东京持续轰炸中丧生
亚洲 超过2000万人丧生
全球 超过6000万人在二战中丧生
【INTERVIEW WITH KOJI WAKAMATSU/若松孝二访谈】
What was the genesis of the film?
Q. 为什么拍摄这部作品?
I had the idea for this new film while I was shooting United Red Army. I felt that, in order to understand the youngsters of the 60s and 70s, you should first describe their parents’ era, the time of the Pacific War. Describing a war doesn’t just mean describing the shooting and the battles.
The people who are most affected by war are the women and children, who don’t even fight.
Those in power fooled the citizens into believing that this war was on behalf of their country, and they manipulated them into rushing into the war. They themselves stayed at a safe distance and were still alive after the war. I thought that the youngsters in United Red Army were born the way they were precisely because their parents had lived through such an era. So I’d already decided at the time of shooting to describe their parents’ era, the Pacific War, and the people of that time.
A. 在拍摄『联合赤军实录』的时我就想拍摄"芋虫"了。我觉得,在理解六,七十年代的年轻人之前,应该首先描述他们父母的年代,也就是太平洋战争。对战争的描述不应该仅限于战斗本身。
受战争影响最大的往往是女性和儿童,即便他们没有参战。
当权者愚弄人民并使他们相信战斗是为了国家,以此鼓动国民参战。这部分当权者并没有参战也不会在战争中丧命。我想在『联合赤军实录』的年轻人生于一个绝对的时代,因为他们父母也经历这样的时代。所以我已经决定要拍摄一部描述他们父母的年代,太平洋战争,以及那个时代的人们。
In what way is the film different from Edogawa Rampo’s novel The Caterpillar, which is about a WWII veteran, who returns home as a quadriplegic?
Q. 江户川乱步的小说芋虫描述了一位在战争中失去四肢的退役军人。您的电影和这部小说同有什么不同?
I was inspired by this image in the novel of the disabled war veteran, who’s lost all his limbs, and his relationship with his wife. Apart from that, the timesetting is different, and so is pretty much everything else.
What I wanted to describe from that initial image was the idea that, for human beings, life means sex, eating and violence.
Moreover, I wanted to describe how human nature can be destroyed by war.
Charlie Chaplin showed us through his cinema that for killing three people you’ll be hanged, whereas you’ll be a hero if you kill ten thousand. That’s war!
A. 我确实受到这部小说的影响,它描述了一位因为战争失去四肢的退伍军人及他和妻子间的关系。除了这些部分保留外,故事发生的年代不同,其他设定也有所不同。
我想描述的是,对于人类而言,生活意味着性,饮食和暴力。
再者,我试图描述人性如何被战争摧毁。
卓别林的在他的电影作品中陈述到:杀三个人可以令你丧命,然而如果杀一千人你就是英雄。这就是战争的事实!
In Johnny Got His Gun (1971), American novelist and director Dalton Trumbo tells the story of a World War I soldier, who lost his arms, legs, and face after being caught in the blast of an exploding artillery shell. Have you seen that film?
Q. 在Johnny Got His Gun这部小说中,美国作家/导演Dalton Trumbo描述了一位第一次世界大战中失去了手脚,并因炮弹爆炸而毁容的士兵。你看过这部电影么?
Yes, I’ve seen it. I saw a human being completely deprived of freedom by war, and I felt how cruel it was that he couldn’t even choose to die. But I don’t think it had any influence on me. Compared to that, at least Kyuzo could choose his own death.
A. 我看过这部电影。我看到一个人被战争剥夺了所有自由,我感到他甚至没有结束自己生命这个选项的残酷。但我并不认为自己受到这部电影的影响。如果要将二者对比的话,至少久藏<芋虫 主人公:黑川久藏>能够选择结束自己的生命。
Where did you get the archives images from?
Q. 资料图片是从何而来?
I borrowed them off a person who had got them from the United States National Archives and Records Administration.
After the war, minor Japanese war criminals were put on trial and punished in various places in Japan. They were also executed under the pretext that it was for the good of their country. But among these there were many Koreans, who had been brought from the Korean peninsula, which was a Japanese colony at that time. They too were put on trial as Japanese war criminals, and were also executed.
Some South and North Koreans, initially accused of being war criminals but later acquitted, were released. They are still ignored by the Japanese government today, and have had no post-war reparation because they aren’t Japanese.
From this point of view, the war still hasn’t finished. Nothing has been resolved.
A. 是一位在美国国家档案馆工作的朋友借给我的。
战后,日本各地有少数日本战犯被审判。然而他们被处决仍是在一个为了自己国家利益的前提下。当中有很多韩国人,他们来自日据时期的朝鲜半岛。这些人也被当作日本战犯审判和处刑。一部分曾经被指控为战犯的南北韩人最终被释放了。现代的日本政府仍然忽视这个事实,因为他们不是日本人所以战后也没有得到任何赔偿。
从这个角度来说,战争并没有结束。问题也还没有解决。
Where did you shoot the film?
Q. 拍摄地点是在?
The film was shot in Nagaoka and around in Niigata prefecture, in the Chubu region (northwest of Tokyo), where there exists typical Japanese landscapes preserved from fifty years ago with traditional wooden straw roof houses surrounded by rice terraces. It was in that rural part of the country known for its high-quality rice where the farmers used to cultivate the rice to feed soldiers during the war and the village people were fully dedicated to the Emperor. I wanted to shoot in that area, not as much for aesthetic or scenic reasons, than for historical reasons –and maybe also because I grew up in a similar village!
A. 长冈市,新泻县周边,以及位于东京西北侧的的中部地区;那里还保存着日本50年前的风貌,传统的木质屋顶,被大米梯田环绕。这些地区的农民在战争中辛勤耕作将最好的大米给士兵食用,并且,他们对天皇忠心耿耿;这是他们广为所知的两件事。我选择该区域拍摄,并不是出于审美或科学的考量,而是考虑到历史的层面--也可能是因为我出生在一个相似的村落。
Tell us more about the character played by Katsuyuki Shinohara, the character that eats flowers and doesn’t do anything like the others.
Q. 请描述一下由 筱原胜之 扮演的吃花的异于常人的角色。
He’s me. He’s the me who has been strongly criticised as an aho, an “idiot”, as a “national disgrace”, as a “sewer”. But by the side of the sewer there blooms a single flower. That’s why I made Katsuyuki eat a flower and so on. In this film his character pretends to be an idiot and goes against the current of plunging into this war. He sticks to his belief of “refusing to do what he hates”. I think he’s probably the most courageous character.
A. 这个角色就是我本人的写照。我被批判为蠢货,日本之耻,以及臭水沟。然而,在臭水沟旁总有鲜花盛开。这就是为什么我让 筱原 吃花及作出其他异于常人的行为。电影中,他的角色装成一个傻子并对投入战争这件事反其道而行。他坚持自己的理念,即,不做自己憎恶的事。我想他可能是电影中最有勇气的人。
What about the casting of Shinobu Terajima and Shima Ohnishi?
Q. 为何选择 大西信满 和 寺岛忍 这两位担纲主演?
As for casting Ohnishi, I’d decided to use him for my next film during the shooting of United Red Army. To play a soldier without limbs, you have to use your eyes a great deal. Ohnishi is very expressive with his eyes.
As for Terajima, she really suits those Japanese farmer’s trousers, monpe. Also, she’s my favourite actress, because she has the courage to act without make-up, even though she’s a huge star.
I wasn’t sure if such a great actress would accept to appear in a film whose director has been the object of such criticism. But when I plucked up the courage to ask her, she accepted.
A.
在拍摄 联合赤军实录 的时候我就决定启用 大西信满 作为我下一部作品的主角。要扮演一个没有四肢的角色,你必须通过眼睛来表达。大西信满 很擅长用眼神演戏。
寺岛忍很适合日本农妇的服装。她也是我最喜欢的女演员,因为她身为一名巨星却愿意不化妆出演。我不确定她作为一个知名的女演员,是否愿意参演一个一直以来被批判导演的电作品。但是当我鼓起勇气邀约的时候,她接受了这个角色。
There are two stories in Caterpillar: the story of a hero that lost his limbs in a war and the story of a husband and wife. What’s the relationship between the two stories?
Q. 芋虫 中有两个故事:一是在战争中失去四肢的英雄,另一个故事则描述了夫妻。这两个故事间的关系是?
Japanese society is basically a man’s society. Men have shamelessly used violence on their wives, they’ve considered their wives as mere outlets for their sexual desires and as machines for producing children. In Japanese society, this kind of relationship between men and women used to be considered normal. Even today, a member of parliament can make statements based on this mindset, that “women are machines for producing children”. I wanted to describe how the relationship between a husband and wife could change into other forms in this society as a result of war. In short, I wanted to describe the way human beings live, by grouping the state, the nation and everything together.
By doing this, I thought I could describe how war is nothing more than killing. Wars for justice, wars for national profit, wars on behalf of democracy… such things don’t exist. Men kill other men, that’s war! How many people have been killed in the name of justice?
After going through the 20th century, which was a century of war, the same situation is still prevailing in the 21st century.
There are no justifiable wars. That’s what I wanted to describe.
A. 日本基本上是男权社会。在过去,男人可以毫不知耻地殴打他们的妻子,把妻子视为衣服一样的存在,用于满足他们的性欲和繁衍后代;这样的关系曾经被日本社会视为是合理的。即便现代,国会议员仍然可以公然宣称:"女人是生孩子的机器"。我想描述在战争影响下夫妻关系如何转变。简而言之,我希望能够描述在国家及其他环境背景下人类的生存方式。
通过这么做,我希望能传达战争只是杀戮的信息。为了正义,为了国家利益,为了民主...这样的战争是不存在的。战争就是杀戮。有多少人因"正义"之名而丧命?
20世纪是充满战争的世纪,21世纪同样的情况仍然普遍。
并不存在正义之战。这就是我想说的。
Is the way women are described in your films (initially being abused but then taking the upper hand) a metaphor somehow?
Q. 在你的作品中,过去被虐待的女性后来处于上风,这是个隐喻么?
There’s no clear metaphor. It’s an image in my head. My films are born inside my head, where all sorts of things are jumbled up. There’s myself, my friends, my country, my mother and father, whom I observed while I was growing up…
My father was violent to my mother when he was drunk.
All these things are in a disorderly mess in my brain. I can’t explain it logically, of course. If I could, I’d be a novelist. I wouldn’t need much money or any staff, and it’d be a lot easier. But as I can’t express all this in words, I use images and noises, including music. That’s all.
A. 这并不是通常意义上的隐喻。而是我脑中的形象。我的作品是在我的脑中和其他东西掺杂在一起而诞生的。我脑中有我自己,我朋友,我的国家,我父母,我成长过程中观察到的人...
我父亲在酒醉时会对我母亲拳脚相向。
所有这些在我脑中都是无序存在的。我自然无法逻辑性的解释它们。如果我能够进行逻辑性阐述的话,我会成为一个作家。也就不需要那么多资金和工作人员,生活一定会容易许多。但是我无法通过语言描述这些在我脑中的形象,我靠图像和声音,包括音乐来讲述。就是这样。
You are known as a guerrilla-style filmmaker (making single shots, no rehearsals, shooting and editing in a very short time etc)…
Q. 你被视为一个"打游击式拍片"的电影制作人(拍短镜头 不排练 拍摄和剪接都在很短时间内完成)
When you do lots of rehearsals, the actors’ tension eases off. If you kill somebody, you don’t practise it lots of times, do you? You just concentrate on that one thing. This is the same. When you’re looking out for a single chance, you don’t need a rehearsal.
A. 进行多次预演后,演员的紧张感就消失了。如果你要杀人,你不会进行多次排练,对吧?而是将精神集中在一个事情上。拍片也是这个道理。你在等待一个独一无二的契机,不需要排演。
What influence does a limited budget have? Do you think a big budget would have changed anything about Caterpillar?
Q. 预算限制对你有什么样的影响?如果预算充裕的话,芋虫 这部电影会有什么不同?
To manage within a limited budget is the Wakamatsu way. Merely having lots of money doesn’t guarantee you’ll shoot something good. Nevertheless, every day during the shooting I wished I had a bigger budget. For example, I could have had more extras in a line if I’d had a bigger budget, and so on. But because you can’t do that you have to rely on actors’ expressions, and you can express these things well. When you have money, you rely on it. But it won’t necessarily produce good work.
We finished the shooting in twelve days, although we’d planned for two weeks. It took about thirteen hours to edit the film, because we changed it three times.
The script took at least three months, shaping our ideas and establishing the concept.
A. 在有限预算下制作电影是典型的 若松孝二 拍摄方式。单单充分的预算并不能保证你拍出一部好电影。然而,拍摄的每一天我都希望自己有更多预算。例如,如果有更多预算我可能可以增加台词。但恰是因为没有那么多预算,我完全依赖演员的诠释,演员能够将它们诠释得很好。当预算充足的时候你就会依赖预算,但并不保证你能拍出好作品。
我们在12天内完成拍摄,虽然我们原定的拍摄时间是两周。电影的剪辑时间大约是13小时,因为我们3次改变剪接。剧本的完成至少花了3个月时间,用于构思。
Your stance as a film director has been changing, from defending the armed struggle in the 1970s to criticising it in United Red Army, and becoming strictly anti-war in Caterpillar. Can you explain the change so far and your plans for the future?
Q. 作为导演,你的立场有所转变,从捍卫70年代的赤军到在联合赤军实录中批判他们,并最终在 芋虫 中表达了反战思想。能否对此作出解释并阐述你下一步的计划?
Actually, in the 1970s I believed that we could change the world through armed struggle. But after that, certain ideas started germinating in my mind. Japan and other Asian countries won’t solve their problems through an armed struggle, and maybe the last effective armed struggles happened at the time of Ché Guevara and Castro.
Furthermore, after doing research and thinking about various things while shooting United Red Army, I finally realised that it’s impossible to change anything through armed struggle. I came to the thinking that things could only be solved through the power of the human spirit, and not by military force.
I don’t hold with these former militants, who used to call for armed struggle and a “simultaneous world revolution”, but who now just use their notoriety to defend their own positions. All they do is spout theories, without accepting how times have changed.
As for what I’m going to portray in the future, it’ll probably be just about men and women. I’m thinking about describing the nastiness of human beings, the sordid part of relationships. On the other hand, I’m interested in the story of Otoya Yamaguchi, a 17-year-old who stabbed the president of the Socialist Party of Japan to death, and then killed himself. He was just a boy who thought he was making the world better, and he died for it.
When all’s said and done, I think I’ll just go on describing human beings.
A. 事实上,在70年代我确实相信武装斗争可以改变世界。但在那之后,我的想法有所改变。日本和其他亚洲国家通过武装斗争并不会真正地解决问题,也许武装斗争的有效性结束在切格瓦拉和卡斯特罗的时代。
在拍摄 联合赤军实录 的过程中我进行了大量相关研究和思考,最终意识到武装斗争是不可能带来改变的。我逐渐领悟到问题的解决是依靠人的本性,而非军事力量。
我和过去的好战人士不同,他们曾经呼吁武装斗争和一个"世界各地同步发生的革命",但他们的实际目的是巩固自身地位。他们行为的实质就是散播理论,却没有考虑到时代的变迁。
我下一步电影制作的方向,可能是纯粹的芸芸众生。我正在考虑描述人类的不洁,人与人关系中利欲熏心的方面。另一方面,我也感兴趣 山口 二矢 的故事,他在17岁时刺杀了日本社会党委员长,而后自杀。他只是一个相信自己可以将世界变得更好的男孩,并为此付出了生命代价。
当所有我想说和想做的都完成了,我想我会开始纯粹的描述人类。
Why, and for whom, do you make films?
Q. 你拍摄电影的原因是什么,又是为了谁?
Why? I make them because I want to make them – for myself, as well as for anybody who watches my films and feels a hatred for war. And it’s also to make a living. The starting point is when I get angry. There are things that make me angry, so I simply express my feelings by using this device called a film.
A. 为什么?我拍摄电影是因为我想拍摄他们--为了我自己,以及所有看我电影或憎恨战争的人。同时它也是我的谋生手段。我拍摄电影的起源是让我愤怒的事物。有那么一些令我忿恨的事情,因此我通过电影这个媒介表达我的感受。
【翻译】官网的简介& 导演采访
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感谢
我反而觉得文字可以更好的表达“印象型“阐述
恩...我想导演更多地是从他个人立场论述
“但是我无法通过语言描述这些在我脑中的形象,我靠图像和声音,包括音乐来讲述。” 所以... 对他来说 影像是更顺手的表达方式?
谢谢分享。
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